FujiApple a year ago

It is hard to overstate the impact that having a BBC micro in my 1980s rural primary school had on my career, without that I'd almost certainly have had a very different path through life. My eternal gratitude to whichever executive or politician decided to fund that program.

  • discretion22 a year ago

    The politician was Margaret Thatcher and the Department Of Trade And Industry (the website calls it Transport and Industry which looks like a typo as transport was the Ministry of Transport) paid 50% of the cost for schools purchasing computers from the Research Machines 380Z, the BBC Micro plus (I didn't know this) the Spectrum.

    https://briansmithonline.com/computing/national-curriculum/c...

    Placing this under the DTI, instead of Ministry of Education, suggests the intention was to encourage success stories precisely like yours; build skills for future employment in industry and building IT literate professionals to enable future UK trade. Surprisingly forward looking for any government department!

    We were lucky enough to have both the 380Z and the BBC Micro (plus some Acorn Atom's as budget alternatives and a number of Apple ][ that pre-dated the whole computers in schools program) plus ECONET ! Our Computing Department head was involved in setting up the program, so we lucky and got a bit of almost everything except the Spectrum. We also had a few different languages available, Comal, Pascal plus the obvious BBC BASIC. I also got to play with a BASIC Compiler (Apple ][ Expediter if I recall the name correctly). I was incredibly lucky as a result of the teacher being involved in setting up the program and the early Computing courses and examinations.

    • tomjakubowski a year ago

      Thatcher was not prime minister when the DTI was established. She was prime minister when the BBC Micro was developed and released. Did she play some role in the development or approval of the project?

      Wikipedia's history doesn't mention anything about politicians being involved. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Micro#History

    • lambic a year ago

      I helped my math teacher (we didn't have computer science yet) set up econet in the computer lab so learned all about how it worked (all of which I've now forgotten) and took advantage of its lack of security for the rest of the year.

      We also transitioned from actual typewriters to beebs in typing class, and I ended up writing a user(/idiots) guide for the beeb word processor.

      • ecpottinger a year ago

        Here it was PetNet, it was amazing how much more the students knew about the computers than the teachers who were suppose to teach them.

    • FujiApple a year ago

      Thanks for the history, really interesting.

      > Surprisingly forward looking for any government department!

      Indeed!

    • anigbrowl a year ago

      Ironic considering the hostility of free market evangelists to any sort of industrial policy.

  • FujiApple a year ago

    Story time:

    When the BBC micro arrived at my tiny rural school the elderly teacher had been given instructions for how to type in and run a simple "hello world" style program to demonstrate what this amazing machine could do.

    She began copy-typing in the program and then invited each of us to sit at the keyboard and add our names to what I imagine was a simple print statement.

    Finally, after quite some time going around the whole class one by one, the program was ready and she pressed return and ..

    Syntax error

    The machine was promptly powered off and put back in the box.

    It would be a few years before it reemerged and, thankfully, captured my interest.

  • dotBen a year ago

    Lots of late 30's/early 40-something Brits in this sub thread I think :D

    BBC Micro was the first computer I ever used, in 1986 upon entering primary school. I remember learning DART and programing the turtle to move around using LOGO (we actually had a physical version too from what I remember).

    My elderly year 1 primary school teacher disliked the computer, however, and told us we needed to spend the time learning to write in pen because "we wouldn't be able to carry a computer on our back for the rest of our lives"!

    My parents soon bought an Acorn A3000 (32bit home computing in 1988!) and I would type out BASIC programs from books from the library and then later edit them to discover I could do my own programming. I don't think there was any free/open source (what we used to call 'shareware') WIMP tools so being about 10 years old my programming was strictly relegated to BASIC as that's all we had.

    I'm a bit depressed to think that Margaret Thatcher had a direct impact on my career in tech, however :/

    • aembleton a year ago

      > I would type out BASIC programs from books from the library

      So did I. Were they the Usbourne books? I found the books again online a few years ago. Don't have a link unfortunately

      • dotBen a year ago

        Yes they were! I remember a lot of Usborne books in the house generally.

  • sparks1970 a year ago

    Likewise. I owe a lot to the BBC micro.

    A few years ago UK schools were flooded with BBC:Micro Bits - everyone in my son's year-group received one.

    I think the idea was similar, seed a new generation with technical know-how. I'm not sure if it will work this time - I guess we will have to wait and see.

    • _joel a year ago

      It was really. I worked at the beeb when it was being worked on and it was very much tyring to strip back all the cludgy layers built up and get real interaction with the device, much the same way as the original did. Yes, there were Pi's but there's a lot more to the stack in that. Hopefully they don't overheat (that was part of my testing I helped with :) ) As for it's efficacy, it definitely sparked a few minds but I don't think anywhere near the effect the original had. There's so many more distraction nowadays for kids too.

  • sshagent a year ago

    Most my friends had Spectrums, i was looking forward to gaming when Santa would surely bring me one too. Alas i got an Acorn Electron. Turns out, having the different system that my extended friend group meant i spent time messing about with coding than gaming. So whilst 'young james' was probably unreasonably unhappy with that Christmas, i think in hindsight it was amazing :)

    • harry-wood a year ago

      Similar. That Christmas when my dad & I started working through the BBC BASIC manual, I thought that this was the exciting experience of owning a computer which my friends were all on about (and I was excited by it!)

      ...It was only some time later I learned about loading pre-written programs (games) on it.

      • stevekemp a year ago

        I've written about this before in more detail:

        https://blog.steve.fi/how_i_started_programming.html

        But the reason I started coding in BASIC was because when we received a ZX Spectrum for Christmas one year the cassette player was broken - no preloaded games for us.

        I was always more interested in programming, and hacking games for infinite lives than actually playing games!

      • sshagent a year ago

        Exactly that. In some ways i'd love to have some of that old code, as icky as it would likely be to view now.

        Does make me wonder how kids of today just start coding, without having to fuss about dev environments. Listening to my young nephew talking about doing python at school sounded encouraging, but python is hardly "I want to learn to python, starting coding in python". Lots of fiddling about. Still he seems to enjoy it.

      • _joel a year ago

        Similar feels but for a 1996 Linux book at Christmas

  • dspillett a year ago

    Less so having them in school, but I cut my programming teeth on an Acorn Electron, then later a BBC Master, that we had at home.

    Mostly in BASIC (a better implementation than most common 8-bits had: proper procs & functions rather than just GOTO/GOSUB and decent variable name length limits) but later with a bit of 6502 assembler added in for sprite drawing/moving & similar (BBC BASIC had a built-in multi-pass assembler – another significant point in its favour).

    I doubt I'd be where I am today if I'd not had that (and my parents had not had the foresight to let me stretch bed-time rules when doing something learn-y rather than just playing games!).

  • wobbleblob a year ago

    It was the Electron for me. Bought it new for the equivalent of less than #100 when Acorn discontinued it, the only computer I could afford from my allowance. Incidentally it also forced me to learn German and English as a kid, to be able to read the manuals and Acorn Magazine.

    Second to learning to read, that machine probably had the largest influence on my career

  • timthorn a year ago

    The archive of the BBC's Computer Literacy Project, of which the BBC Micro was a key part, is now online. Lots of fascinating programmes: https://clp.bbcrewind.co.uk/

  • ecpottinger a year ago

    While the Apple II and the PET/Commodore 64 were big here in Canada, I sure wished we had the BBC Micro here too.

macshome a year ago

I'm not an RGB sort of guy, but that backlit motherboard is amazing.

This whole thing is a great read and an amazing labor of love.

rbanffy a year ago

After playing with a C64 Maxi replica (mine has the VIC-20 colors) I can't think of using a vintage computer without a matching keyboard (and often mouse). The experience is not only the pixels on the screen and the sounds of the speaker, but the whole spatial relationship with the physical object.

It probably doesn't need to be an almost perfect replica like the 64 Maxi, but having the keys in the same places (even if there is no ESC key - looking at you, DEC LK-201). On my desk, my two daily drivers are a Sun Type 7c (Type 7 is in storage, waiting for its rotation) and an IBM/Lexmark/Unicomp PC-122 Model M, and I can say each of them provides a unique experience, tactile, spatial, and, on the Model M's case, auditory.

I'm thinking about learning how to build keyboards and make a couple DIY ones. Switches can't be the same, but, at least, physical layout, keycap shapes, labels, and colors can be matched.

outworlder a year ago

> It might be relatively unknown outside UK

They are well known to anyone that was interested in Elite. BBC Micro has the best Elite version, after all :)

That said, that ATX4VC thing looks fantastic. I have recently restored a MSX computer back to life, but I think the power supply is unstable and crapping up when the machine warms up. It also contributes significant noise. Maybe it's time to replace with a modern PSU instead of spending time trying to fix the wimpy transformer-based PSU.

EDIT: I realize that cheap devices like this already existed. But this one seems to be much more complete (and trustworthy!). It's too bad that many printers use 24V rather than 12, otherwise this would be helpful for those scenarios too.

BirAdam a year ago

Coolest part, imho, is the ATX4VC. I rather like to keep my vintage computers as close to original as possible, but the PSU change is super handy!

  • outworlder a year ago

    Good thing is, those changes are _generally_ reversible. In some computers you might have to cut board traces though.

reaperducer a year ago

In 1990 I did something similar with a Commodore 64. Mine wasn't as slick and well done as this one, but it had a C-64, two floppy drives, internal modem, RAM expansion, and three cartridge ports selectable via push button, in a case intended for an IBM clone. I was never able to find a good case for the keyboard, so I ended up putting it in a cardboard cookie box until I could find something better.

After that experience, I got into the world of build-your-own IBM clones, and I don't remember what ever happened to the 64. Kinda sad.

watmough a year ago

Not sure I like that knock-off copy of WordWise.

The original company Computer Concepts, now renamed Xara GMBH are amazingly still around! Wonder if they did a 40 years in business celebration?

Grazester a year ago

"BBC Micro motherboard requires two voltages: +5V and -5V. The former powers all the chips, and the latter only for sound and serial communication. Fortunately, 5V is readily available on a ATX PSU, and -5V can be derived from -12V with a simple 7905 linear regulator"

The power ATX power supply also supplied -5 volts. Why did they need to use a linear regulator to on the -12v line derive -5v?

Edit:// my question was previously asked an answered.

  • adrian_b a year ago

    Since 2003 (ATX12V version 1.3), the -5 V rail has become optional.

    Most recent power supplies no longer provide it.

gorgoiler a year ago

My teachers at University were involved in the project. If you were one of that influential cohort who developed this machine, you were rewarded with your initials being included on the silicon die. Pretty rad.

A major piece of Beeb history was also the manual. Without a doubt the most important book of my childhood.

soneil a year ago

> It's amazing how quickly a simple idea can get out of hand

No kidding!

  • Malic a year ago

    That statement is somewhat analogous to what is said about software development (in the tone of JFK's "moonshot" voice), "...we do things things not because they are easy but because we thought they would be easy..." :)

b800h a year ago

This is a lovely project, given that the original Beeb wasn't "damaged" per se. I have a few Beeb mainboards with unrecoverable cases, and this sort of thing might be a very good destination for one.

TheRealPomax a year ago

Hilarious as the submission title is, it should be updated to match the article's title, which is "Pimp My Beeb" =)

jamiek88 a year ago

This thread and memories made me tear up.

BBC micro and econet were amazingly hackable and still have fond memories.

Bruteus you in this thread? It’s Apollo here!

(Bruteus and Apollo fucking owned our econet. Until we got suspended and banned of course. Hard to emphasize how scared of computers and our superior ability with them our teachers were).

HarHarVeryFunny a year ago

Very nice!

Great way to make a Beeb more practical to use as well as give it some drip!

Now, if you could add USB storage and an HDMI adapter ...

6stringmerc a year ago

How clever! Getting the introduction section really helped. Glad to check it out, highly recommended!

Phelinofist a year ago

Why does it have a 650W PSU? I would assume the components are quite light on the power consumption.

To be clear: that is an amazing project and I don't want to take anything away from it, just wondering.

  • tenebrisalietum a year ago

    Is it a fair heuristic that higher wattage PSUs are higher quality?

    Also since the desktop market is pretty much servicing mostly gamers at this point, can you even get a ATX PSU under 500W anymore?

  • TheRealPomax a year ago

    Looks at his pile of spare PSUs I'd probably have stuck an 800W in there just because that's what's sitting unused in the cupboard =D

saghul a year ago

This is incredible. Not only the final result is breathtaking, but the intermediate projects you created to support it are awesome too! The duckyPad looks very nice too!

pvitz a year ago

Really great project!

What I didn't understand was why there is a need for a 7905 to convert -12V to -5V. It looks like that pin 20 should be providing the -5V already?

  • dekuNukem a year ago

    -5V has became optional in recent ATX specifications, and many newer PSUs don’t have it at all. (including the one I used here)

    -12V is still mandated and on all ATX PSUs, so it’s more compatible to get -5V out of that.

    • rzzzt a year ago

      Backplanes of industrial PCs occasionally also have a spot for adding a -5V voltage regulator for the same reason.

mrlonglong a year ago

I had an amstrad PC1512 with a 32MB hard card. This was awesome for college and uni as everyone used x86 machines.

hinkley a year ago

I wonder if those floppies are a standard connector that would accept an upgrade to more compact designs.

3stripe a year ago

Are there any safety considerations with regards to having the power supply and other innards exposed?

  • ZiiS a year ago

    The ATX PSU (labeled CX650F here) converts wall power to a maximum of 12v DC. It's metal case is earthed so short of sticking pointy metal bits though the fan grills it is safe to touch.

    The rest of the system only sees the 12v DC or less which remains completely safe to touch. The PSU can not (and will not due to fuses) supply enough current to risk fire (like a 12v car battery).

  • Bayart a year ago

    Having the PSU case exposed is electrically identical to having a pc case exposed. Having it opened on the other hand is a danger. PSU capacitors are known to be large enough to kill.

TwoNineA a year ago

Oh, I knew I recognized that name somewhere. Thank you for the duckyPad, it's awesome.

JaDogg a year ago

Very good project. duckyPad looks good as well.

guiltily look at few raspberry pi I have lying around

flir a year ago

This is glorious.

madengr a year ago

Glass PC cases; so much for EMI compliance. The old computers had metalized plastic cases for a reason.