It's wild that building bespoke software that fits your needs instead of relying on a one-size-fits-all approach that you're constantly battling against is frowned upon.
I have to ask myself what business you could possibly be in where you look at the software landscape and think "Yea, this aligns perfectly with my needs".
Maybe this is what and how it always should have been. My life is better now that an LLM proxies my human sound waves and finger clacks to bits that do what I say - and precisely what I say nothing else
The UI looks a bit outdated, it gives me vibes of some old software from 2000s somehow (probably because of the Java).
And it would be really helpful to clearly state benefits of using Milkman instead of Postman right on the home page (e.g. performance benchmarks, UX, extendability, etc.). I see that it has some users and 1.3k stars so there're definitely some cool things in Milkman, probably you could just present them better
How about writing it in C++ or Rust and doing away completely with huge memory footprint and long startup times. Java also needs a runtime, which is bothersome.
I suggest using wxWidgets or Qt so you get multi-platform support for free.
Are API testing UIs really relevant anymore? I haven't manually tested an API for almost two years, and my APIs are SO much better. This kind of GUI is going to die over the next 5 years.
I'm thinking the same thing, I haven't have a need for a tool like Postman in a long time, prompting is enough at this point. I wonder what features others use from Postman that an agent can't do quickly.
Quickly eye-balling onprem responses, skipping over UIs and just eyeballing data in general is really useful. Curl can do it but with a couple headers it becomes messy, also RPCs, websockets, etc. It’s just convenient to have a single place where you can eyeball all comms.
You're not wrong - I bought a Bruno "Golden Edition" for $9 two years ago pre-release... and... I just don't use it. I'm not even sure why I keep it around, at 524.5 MB
That's an interesting point. I wonder if over the next X years consumers will free up ALOT of disk space by just using agents and not needing to download and install desktop software.
Full disclosure, I'm building a desktop app called DB Pro [1] which is a modern desktop database client.
We're still doing well, and selling a lot, but we're having to think about what the next 2/3/4/5 years look like...
When I saw the UI, my first thought was "is that written in Java"? And indeed, it is. Kinda funny that it's so easy to spot that language based on its horrible default UI skins alone.
I switched to Yaak, initially compiled it myself but now paying for it. I've not had any issues with it, does what I need and keeps out of the way. Simple yaml files in Git is also nice. I would recommend giving it a spin. I think there is a trial, and you can build it yourself, with a bit of configuring.
Insomnia has been around for a while but just like this post from a new account, there is a lot of push for bruno, which is usually a redflag. Never trust things that are "preached" for free.
I would stay off Insomnia. A few versions ago, they practically took my local configuration ransom so they could force me to create a cloud account. Bruno is (still) not there, but the maintainers are slowly heading that way.
The author appears to be suggesting that a key difference between Bruno and Insomnia is that Milkman not written in JavaScript/Electron, but rather JavaFx (i.e., Java) and thus is faster.
For a Postman-like experience, I prefer Bruno: https://github.com/usebruno/bruno (not affiliated)
Never used milkman so can't say if it's better, but +1 for Bruno.
1. Very similar UX to postman (just minus the bullshit), so a very easy transition.
2. It's FOSS*
3. Most importantly of all, it has a cute dog logo.
* oof, just saw this on another comment: https://royathan.com/blog/the-api-client-hunt/
The Hurl file format seems good, any new FOSS replacements should probably build on top
Bruno is VC funded.
Also yaak https://yaak.app/
Bruno is also VC funded so it'll go the same way.
- I got sick of all those electron-based applications - I created a JavaFx-based workbench
Oh boi
Modern JavaFX isn't your grandparents JavaFX, in fact, modern Java isn't your grandpa's Java.
So I'm my own grandpa? Whats sorcery is this?
Yes, you're a dinosaur now, I am afraid. Kids born in 2000 are 26 year old.
We are in an age where it’s easier to vibe code your own alternative than to do a quick internet search to check if an alternative already exists.
What a wonderful usage of resources.
It's wild that building bespoke software that fits your needs instead of relying on a one-size-fits-all approach that you're constantly battling against is frowned upon.
I have to ask myself what business you could possibly be in where you look at the software landscape and think "Yea, this aligns perfectly with my needs".
Maybe this is what and how it always should have been. My life is better now that an LLM proxies my human sound waves and finger clacks to bits that do what I say - and precisely what I say nothing else
Magnificent. One step closer to self sufficient community ships drifting through the system, meeting up with other ships once a month or less.
The UI looks a bit outdated, it gives me vibes of some old software from 2000s somehow (probably because of the Java). And it would be really helpful to clearly state benefits of using Milkman instead of Postman right on the home page (e.g. performance benchmarks, UX, extendability, etc.). I see that it has some users and 1.3k stars so there're definitely some cool things in Milkman, probably you could just present them better
It looks like a windows app running on macOS.
Both the application UI and website are giving open source option from 2008
How about writing it in C++ or Rust and doing away completely with huge memory footprint and long startup times. Java also needs a runtime, which is bothersome.
I suggest using wxWidgets or Qt so you get multi-platform support for free.
Are API testing UIs really relevant anymore? I haven't manually tested an API for almost two years, and my APIs are SO much better. This kind of GUI is going to die over the next 5 years.
Postman should be seriously worried.
I'm thinking the same thing, I haven't have a need for a tool like Postman in a long time, prompting is enough at this point. I wonder what features others use from Postman that an agent can't do quickly.
Quickly eye-balling onprem responses, skipping over UIs and just eyeballing data in general is really useful. Curl can do it but with a couple headers it becomes messy, also RPCs, websockets, etc. It’s just convenient to have a single place where you can eyeball all comms.
You're not wrong - I bought a Bruno "Golden Edition" for $9 two years ago pre-release... and... I just don't use it. I'm not even sure why I keep it around, at 524.5 MB
...and... it's gone
That's an interesting point. I wonder if over the next X years consumers will free up ALOT of disk space by just using agents and not needing to download and install desktop software.
Full disclosure, I'm building a desktop app called DB Pro [1] which is a modern desktop database client.
We're still doing well, and selling a lot, but we're having to think about what the next 2/3/4/5 years look like...
[1] https://dbpro.app
You will own nothing and be happy they said
> if over the next X years consumers will free up ALOT of disk space by just using agents and not needing to download and install desktop software
Trading bits you own for rented redundant compute to recreate same seems... suboptimal?
How much power should we burn on everyone's agent recreating curl?*
* yes, agents have tools, but what is and isn't an agent tool is a gray area. "Desktop software" could be an agent tool with a human UI.
> Are API testing UIs really relevant anymore?
We have a postman collection mainly for testers to manually verify certain aspect of a otherwise fairly unit and end-to-end test covered API.
Export to curl?
They are testers, not devs. They don't know how to use command line, or edit environment variables.
Have you considered converting this to an actual test suite in $language with AI doing the majority of the work?
Isn’t testing an API just more test cases that Claude toils through? Why do I care about milkman Bruno or postman.
Looking at such ugly UI breaks my heart :(
Why?
https://github.com/postmanlabs/postman-app-support/issues/14... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50354960
Have you ever heard about Bruno?
Came here to say this. While not perfect, Bruno is certainly the best tool in this category that I have used :)
When I saw the UI, my first thought was "is that written in Java"? And indeed, it is. Kinda funny that it's so easy to spot that language based on its horrible default UI skins alone.
> New features regularly. There are more and more plugins/features coming.
Why all software needs to constantly evolve and grow with features? This is how you end up with what Postman has become.
By the time I decided I should maybe try postman, I was absolutely turned off that it wants you to setup an account (for what?).
Went with Insomnia instead (which IIRC also wants an account now?) and now just some text-mode VSCode http client.
What is better than the existing, established alternatives https://www.usebruno.com/ and https://insomnia.rest/ ?
Not that I necessarily recommend yaak but this post explains why Bruno and Insomnia are not to be trusted: https://royathan.com/blog/the-api-client-hunt/
I switched to Yaak, initially compiled it myself but now paying for it. I've not had any issues with it, does what I need and keeps out of the way. Simple yaml files in Git is also nice. I would recommend giving it a spin. I think there is a trial, and you can build it yourself, with a bit of configuring.
I think Insomnia and Bruno are both non-native JS apps, I think the moat here is that "this" is not "that".
Insomnia has been around for a while but just like this post from a new account, there is a lot of push for bruno, which is usually a redflag. Never trust things that are "preached" for free.
if you use VS Code, there are a lot of alternatives:
[0]: https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=humao.re... - rest client storing config locally
[1]: https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=Christia...
[2]: https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=prawel.r... - same as [0], but with GUI
[3]: https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=slverma....
etc.
what is wrong with curl and httpie (I mean the open source cli one, no idea what the desktop one does)?
I know this is tongue-in-cheek, but every time somebody mentions Postman or Bruno, I think of https://justuse.org/curl because so much of is is true.
I would stay off Insomnia. A few versions ago, they practically took my local configuration ransom so they could force me to create a cloud account. Bruno is (still) not there, but the maintainers are slowly heading that way.
I wish the milkman would deliver my milk... In the morning...
You have so many machines Richard
The author appears to be suggesting that a key difference between Bruno and Insomnia is that Milkman not written in JavaScript/Electron, but rather JavaFx (i.e., Java) and thus is faster.
when will it run on AmigaOS?
What’s next garbageman?
Jokes aside, why is it better?
I think that it was posted in regards to the recent news, see: Postman silently auto-installs AI plugins and attempts to share all API data.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50354960
Spiderman?
Your GUI screenshots are squished on mobile. Stretched vertically.
i hate this more than electron
Yet another Postman alternative...